Fri
Jul 17 2009
07:03 pm

When did we go wrong? When did grownups decide that the way to be an adult was to live "for the children"? Is it not possible to live and enjoy life, produce and provide, love and be happy without being consumed by the lives of our children?

"It's for the children" has to be silliest rationale a politician, official, or pundit could use as justification for anything. In fact, in the end it is almost never really for or about the children.

What really bothers and concerns me is that since we begin living and doing everything "for the children”, our lives and society have been going downhill.

Perhaps adults doing adult things for adult reasons might actually work to improve the lives of our children more than doing everything "for the children". It is hard to set an example for our offspring if all they see us doing are childish things for them. Certainly, the “it’s for the children” trend appears to have created great numbers of egocentric kids who think that any and everything should be for them.

In any case, for me the best times growing up where when I shared adult times with my parents. The best times where when we did things as a family because that is what my parents enjoyed like boating, camping, or traveling. The best times where when I was with my parents and they were enjoying themselves doing adult activities. Simple things like joining in adult conversation at the dinner table, or laying awake on New Year’s Eve listening to my parents share laughter with their adult friends grabbed by attention then and now. On the few times we went out to eat I never remember my parents picking a restaurant because "the kids will like it". And Mom never cooked special meals for us kids; we ate when and what the adults ate and if we didn't like it we knew we had better pretend otherwise or go hungry.

As I look back, having a distinct division between children and adults was good thing. At my house, there was no blurring the line between adults and children. We knew who the kids were and who the bosses where. We went to bed at dark because we were the kids. We ate chicken legs and not the breasts because adults pulled rank. We had to shut up and behave because we were told to and adults were bigger than we were. There was no equality, parity, or fairness - kids were kids and adults their bosses.
To be honest this was good arrangement because it made it safe for me to be a kid; I could count on my parents to take care of the adult stuff.

Even sitting at the kids table at holiday time was meaningful. It gave us kids something to look forward to – the time when we would be invited to the adult table. I can still remember when just a few years after I graduated from college when I graduate to the adult table for the first time. :)

I suspect that today’s kids have nothing to look forward to because we no longer differentiate between adults and children. Heck, we are so busy doing “it for the children” that most of our children will likely sink into long years of despair when the inevitable day arrives when they are no longer children and no one is doing "it" for them. The fact is that today's children will never get to move up to the adult table because they never sat at the kids table.

I can't imagine how today's children will learn to be adult or enjoy their lives as adults (many are not). I am certain that I learned just as much helping my Dad build a utility shed as I would had it been a club house for my brother and I. I am sure holding and handing tools to my Dad as he cursed an obstinate transmission out from under the car was just a much fun as playing make believe with toy tools (I couldn’t help giggling each time my Dad cracked his knuckle and swore at our old Packard Clipper he had lovingly christened "the Beast".)

Believe it or not, when I look back on my childhood the best times were also sharing adversities with my adult parents. My parents understood that the best thing to do "for the children" was to share their adult lives with us instead of creating a make believe life centered on us. By allowing us to see the reality of their lives instead of a fairy tale existence where everything is "for the children" they better prepared us for our own lives most of which would not be spent as children.

Instead of doing everything for my brother and me and always doing kid things for us, they included us in their world. By allowing us to share adult things with them, we learned life lessons.

My parents didn’t coddle us. When my Dad was laid off and out of regular work, he took us with him on the odd jobs he found (we were expected to help). When the meat mostly disappeared from our dinner table, we knew why and because we understood how hard Dad worked to buy hamburger, when we had them the burgers tasted so much better.

My parents allowed us to try and fail at tasks beyond our age and ability and in so doing we learned an important lesson – life is not easy and the chance of failure is just as great as success so you had better work hard.

In the end, if we adults do everything "for the children" aren’t we robbing them of the chance to move gradually from childhood to adulthood (aren't we retarding our own growth as adults)?

Perhaps we should rethink this inane child centered religion that mandates everything must be “for the children”. Maybe adults should return to doing what’s best for them, making adult decisions for adult reasons and doing adult things which inevitably works out just fine for the children.

Good blog Brant. But one of

Good blog Brant. But one of the things I have seen that is happening is that... so many of the children of today have parents who are still acting like children themselves. There is not that much "adult" interaction for the children to gauge their life by.

There have always been "doting" parents

And there always will be. The children of such parents used to be referred to as precocious,or self centered. Those characteristics are becoming more and more common among young people today.

Somehow, we have gone into an indulgence mode with our kids that fails to stress the importance of self discipline and goal achievement.

Today's kids are drawn too quickly towards adulthood and the simple pleasures we 50 and 60 somethings knew as children are long gone. Bikes, pick up baseball games and playing in the dirt have been replaced by computers, highly competitive adult supervised athletics,and other activities that will "prepare" kids for adulthood. Even our school forgo basic education and teach to measurement tests and standards.

Interestingly, with all this attention,our kids continue to fall behind from an educational standpoint. Did anyone watch the national spelling bee in DC? ....the top kids were Indian and Asian. The parents of these kids make a different kind of sacrifice....rather than indulge their kids they make them sit down and study, and do so relentlessly.

I would tend to agree with BW that kids should not be the absolute center of their parents lives and should remain at the "kids table"
until they display signs of maturity.

"Precocious?"

While I generally agree with you, Randmart, I never heard "precocious" used like that. It always had positive connotations for me. What does the dictionary say?

"1. unusually advanced or mature in development, esp. mental development: a precocious child."
"2. prematurely developed, as the mind, faculties, etc."

Source: Dictionary.com Unabridged
Based on the Random House Dictionary, © Random House, Inc. 2009. Retrieved from the web 7-17-2009 at (link...)

Are you sure you didn't mean another word? :) Just checking.

-- OneTahiti

Perhaps not the best choice

However I don't regard "having developed or matured early or too soon" as a positive.

Randmart

Do you have a link for your "having developed or matured early or too soon" definition quote?

"Too soon" seems quite judgmental and the dictionaries I checked didn't use that language. Again, just checking. :)

-- OneTahiti

We southerners use the word

We southerners use the word "precocious" as a gentile way of saying your child is ...a spoiled rotten, overbearing, rude, coddled, bullying brat!

Of course we can get away with saying anything about anyone as long as we use the praise "Bless their heart" somewhere in the sentence!

I was born in Texas

That must explain the difference. :)

-- OneTahiti

Freudian typos?

"as a gentile way of saying"

You probably meant gentle, but it's perfect coming from you.

Living and teaching Earth friendly sustainable agricultural practices.

Actually I meant "genteel",

Actually I meant "genteel", I just had brain fade for a minute there!
But why the criticism?

Not a criticism,

rather an observation as you are the quintessential gentile on this site.
Bless your heart! :>)

Living and teaching Earth friendly sustainable agricultural practices.

Farmer Leaf

Wow! Your "quintessential gentile" quip might have been funny were it not so offensive. "Bless your heart," you are usually more PC than that. :)

-- OneTahiti, born and raised a "gentile"

My understanding of gentile

was gleaned from looking it up in Websters Dictionary. 1. To denote a non-Jew. A Christian.
Harrimanite has certainly made no secret that he considers himself a Christian with strongly held fundamental Christian beliefs. My calling him the quintessential gentile was to affirm his comments on "spoiled rotten....children," a view of doted over "coddled" children unlikely to be held by Jewish parents.

Living and teaching Earth friendly sustainable agricultural practices.

Farmer Leaf

"Bless your heart," you are digging yourself in even more. Now you are making generalizations about Jews, too?

Oy veh.

-- OneTahiti

While I have a shovel in my hand

All statements about cultures are by necessity generalizations, as there are always exceptions.
Having said that, it is probably more likely a cultural trait that Jewish children would be doted over and not considered "spoiled." In Israel, where the Sabbath is still faithfully observed, all corporal punishment against children is against the law.

Whereas "spare the rod and spoil the child" is less likely to be a cultural practice of Southern U.S. gentiles. Corporal punishment of children was the norm in this country until the "liberals" and their ACLU allies had it banned in most places.

Living and teaching Earth friendly sustainable agricultural practices.

Farmer Leaf

"Bless your heart," I give up.

-- OneTahiti

Don't have a clue why you

Farmer Leaf,
I don't have a clue why you would label me that.

I don't particularly like "titles" especially from people who don't really know me. How someone posts on a site is NOT ALWAYS a TRUE indication of someone's real traits and personality.

But, I can see how a person could draw a conclusion about someone by the way they post, especially when they insult others, or put them down, or question their education, or mental capacity, etc. It could lead readers to think of them as a pompous ass, among other titles, I guess!

I agree Brant because it's not REALLY for the children anyway

It's for the parent's own ego.

Every generation of parents complains about "kids today".

Our kids today are GREAT kids! We live in a changing world, and our kids' activities have changed since we were kids.

There's still plenty of pressure on kids, in fact a lot more...it's just a different kind of pressure.

I do agree Brant that parents today "over-parent". A lot of kids can't just play ball for the fun of it anymore. They hear the words "atheletic scholarship" before they are ten years old. And it's not just sports; our kids are dragged from one activity to another for years.

Our kids are bombarded with technology. Computers, cell phones, iPods, etc. Keeping up with changing technology is necessary for our kids to be competitive.

Unfortunately, it's not the simple life we once enjoyed. Our kids are almost forced to multi-task.

I think parents need to give kids today a break. They need to let them be bored enough, safely sneaky enough, and trust them enough to make tough choices so they can actually learn to think independently. Parents need to let kids fail!

Our kids are trying in their own not-so-understandable ways, just as we did, to seek their own identity.

Of course they are self-centered! It's nature. It's the stage, the phase and the age. Fortunately most of us outgrow it.

When I run into old friends and conversation turns to our kids, they always ask "what are your kids involved in?" They want to know: "Do they play ball, cheer, play an instrument, dance?" That is their measuring stick for success? How much a kid can multi-task???

"She's an avid reader" generally earns a blank stare.

Our kids only have a short time before they'll pretty much work until they die.

Tonight while I was gone my teenager and a friend put a plastic tarp on a slope in the yard, added baby oil, water and themselves in swim suits. I'm cool with that. It's a complete waste of time and I hope they waste some more.

Parents, please STOP micro-managing your kids!

Probably the biggest thing wrong with kids today is adults, and their perception of kids.

My oldest has a phrase she frequently uses whenever I question the manner in which she is doing a task. She plainly says "don't judge me". I get the message.

Kids today may listen to some distasteful music, their hair may be look funny, their piercings might not be in their ears.

But when you talk with them, if you listen really closely, and you don't block your memory, you'll find they are very much the same inside as you were at that very age.

I'm really not sure why so many parents recently decided kids have to be perfectly polite, expectation-meeting, report-back-to-me-when your poop looks weird, high achievers.

I have to say to my own spouse about once a week in different ways:

"The kid's are alright".

Statistically, the kids today are alright. Maybe even more so than us. We should try not to interfere so much. We were once kids. The hard part is remembering and admitting just how stupid we were at times.

The Computer Has Ruined Our Children

BrantWW, I lived the same kind of life that you did when I grew up. When I was a kid, we played outside all the time that there was day light. We had TV, but did not want to stay in and watch it. We loved playing outside, building forts, playing marbles, hopscotch, volley ball, dodge ball, tag, soft ball, basketball, riding bikes, sliding down hills on card board boxes from refrigerators, camping, water skiing, swimming, etc. I loved sitting in swings and rockers on the front porch of my grandpa's house and listening to all the adults (grandparents, parents, and aunts and uncles) tell their tales, and believe me they told some funny tales. We really were allowed to be kids when I was a kid, and we had our places as kids (separated from the adults).

We didn't have computer games, i.e. X-Box, Nintendo, Gameboy, etc. All my grandsons want to do is play those type computer games. It is the first thing that they do when they get up in the morning. They spend hours playing X-Box games. My son-in-law is a gamer so he sets the example for them. His selection of games he plays with his, also adult, brothers are pretty brutal. My son-in-law does play adult hockey at the local ice rink to keep from getting fat. He is only 36 years old, has anxiety attacks, and is border line diabetic, so he has to watch his weight. At least the kids will get out side on the driveway and play hockey with him.

I think that a lot of influence on our kids behavior is from the TV shows that they watch. I Carly, Hanna Montana, Sponge Bob Square Pants, etc., are the good shows that my daughters let my grandsons watch, and my grandsons turn around and talk smart-mouthed, just like they do on TV, to their parents. They don't talk to me that way, because I won't let them. We were not allowed to talk that way to any adults. We were taught to be respectful.

Things have changed. Parents seem to be too busy for their children today. When both parents work, they are both to tired to deal with the kids after the house work is done in the evening. My mom didn't work, and I loved coming home from school to amazing home cooked meals. The smell and taste of Mom's home made apple pie, yeast bread, fried potatoes, and meatloaf or fried chicken was to die for. When Dad got home from work we all ate dinner, us kids cleaned up the dishes, and then we played outside until it started getting dark.

Because of the micro wave oven, those days of the home cooked meals seem to be gone. Women don't want to slave behind a stove today. I honestly can't blame them, because it is not fun after working all day at a job away from home, to come home and cook. Things are just not the same as they were back then. We want too many things (bigger houses, more and newer vehicles, four wheelers, etc.), so both parents have to work to pay for all that. There is where we have gone wrong.

I sure you meant that your

I sure you meant that your "mom didn't work"... "outside the home". Because back in the days of bigger families and less convenience items, stay at home mothers worked very hard!

I remember a secretary at

I remember a secretary at work a couple of years ago complaining that she found that buying diapers for her walking-talking toddler was putting a strain on the family budget, and was irritated that her child did not seem to want to graduate to toilet-training. I asked her if she had discussed this with the child, to help the child understand the difficulties a Mom and Dad had to deal with and how the child could do his share. She looked at me, stunned, wondering if this was a subject a child could deal with: I told her I thought children had to learn to start dealing with the ups AND downs of life to get a full picture. I remember when my parents and I had my first "adult" talk: it sure opened my eyes and helped me understand that life was not all about ME.

Arrested Development-Food for Thought

Before we go blaming this and that for ruining our kids, we should take a moment to consider our own arrested adult development. A lot of the folks in East Tennessee seem to have topped out somewhere in High School, in spite of their chronological age.

Boys usually stop playing "Army" by the time they are 10 or 11 years old. What is a HUMMER but a big, dangerous Army Toy? Then there are the people who dress up in camo and shoot paintballs at each other at special "camps" on the weekends.

And when did adults start celebrating Halloween? It has become the biggest commercial event right behind Christmas. And don't even get me started on Christmas, the grossest display of material excess imaginable. And this year, in case hard financial times should curb one's excessive compulsion to satisfy material cravings, the "official" Christmas shopping season has already begun at major retailers, and it's only July!

Infantile thinking is demonstrated by an incessant urge to "have it now." Isn't that where our culture has arrived? What is Fed-Ex, overnight delivery, Rooms-To-Go, fast junk food, drive through windows, cell phones, 24 hour ATMs, but the "adult version" of I want it now and I can't wait. Sure, we have "adult" reasons for why we need these "necessities," but is it any more valid than the reasoning of a young child?

Living and teaching Earth friendly sustainable agricultural practices.

Wow That Was a Great Reply Farmer Leaf

You did nail that one Farmer Leaf. I wish that everyone thought like you. This world would be a lot better off. I am not going to celebrate Halloween, or Christmas, or Easter any more. They are only commercialized days where the merchants make a lot of money, the banks pile in the money on interest, and our children become more spoiled. It is all about money, and I am tired of it. There is something wrong with the picture. It is just too money crazy in the world today, and I don't plan to participate any longer. It makes life so much easier. One should give gifts to people when they want to, not when they have to on a particular day of the year.

Nailed and Driven Home

FL , you nailed that one.

Perhaps some of the problems you list are the residual effect of the do it "for the children" mentality of the parents of the do it for me, need it now people you point out.

Celebrate Your own way!

Just because MOST seem to want to celebrate Christmas and Easter materially,they are not forcing me to be part of it! Sure,I may give a few gift's but,I try and focus on the true meaning;the birth and death and resurrection of my Lord and savior,Jesus Christ!

I am glad I have a mind that let's me decide what's right for me! We have an AWESOME God!

Corporal Punishment

Mom raised 8 of us on here own. She worked 2 jobs to do it. If we did not stay in line, we got out butts beat. If somebody in the room was in trouble, everybody in the room got it. I guess she figured we would do something sooner or later, lol.

And, when she cranked up the belt, I just knew it was electric and adjustable. It flew with speed, and hit you no matter where you were in the room.
And then, there was the rubber arm. Seems like no matter how far you got away, she would reach out and pull you back in.

But hey, 5 boys and 3 girls turned into fine men and women. I may have exagerated a little about the punishment, but we all turned out OK. And, I thought somebody needed a good laugh.

If somebody in the room was

If somebody in the room was in trouble, everybody in the room got it. I guess she figured we would do something sooner or later, lol.

LOL! That made me laugh. My MIL used to say that her mother would tell them she was going to whup them good later on because she wanted them to suffer while wondering when they would get it. Sometimes she said it would be days later. LOL

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